>> john: live looks at the white house briefing room at columbia university where it is now 2:00 eastern. the school's deadline for

student protesters to leave that caught or face suspension. the nypd says offices are on the scene for potential protests. we are trying to get cameras inside columbia to follow along. >> sandra: then number of protesters continue to grow. any minute now, karine jean-pierre is expected to take to that podium as these protests spread on campuses coast-to-coast. in just a moment during the white house calling out anti-semitism at columbia over the weekend. peter doocy is in their room for that briefing. we are going to bring you that as soon as it begins. >> john: there is the story from "the new york post," it was time to find another job. i'm john roberts in washington. >> sandra: i am sandra smith in new york. this is "america reports." 800 people have been arrested at their campus protests this month. 200 of those coming in just over the weekend. >> there is one post i suggested

that something -- and is really frustrating that university administration is not standing up for what is morally right. >> sandra: alexis mcadams is live at columbia university. that was a student who joined us last hour. he is at university of michigan. and has been an awful time for those students. columbia university. we have arrived at that 2:00 eastern time deadline. are the protesters moving out? >> good afternoon prayer the protesters aren't going anywhere as of right now. you can see these groups right side of the main gates. upper west side. changing "free palestine from the river to the sea, palestine must be free." the university said it is, very days now. and out of the encampments or you're going to be suspended. i want to take you to have my

photographers no man at the main gates of columbia and take our live camera mats and the crowd right now at one 16th and broadway. columbia university telling the students, get out of out of solidarity and can't manner get suspended. the group does continue to grow. one about things they have enchanting is telling the students hold their ground and telling the nypd, they need to back down and get away from campus. the new york police department is here on standby. they have not been asked to come in just yet. you can see that they do have those police mixed in with the protesters. the police have gotten used to this. not just at nyu but across the city and waiting for that call from columbia's president who said, you guys have for 2:00. that deadline is 2 minutes passed. we also have the shots. you can see how many tents we are talking about.

dozens of these tents set up your days in bathroom set up and brought in supplies. they plan to stay there. we talked to some of these student groups. they plan to be out here for days to come. when they say we know who you are in the crown and if you don't get out of there, you will be suspended. they think that is a threat. they don't really think since she has been negotiating with them. when the nypd when i time time we saw them take those people out. >> sandra: this latter event went out from the columbia office of public affairs, it was a brief email right about at that deadline of 2:00 eastern time. addressing what they called a rumor of a state of emergency at columbia university. they say in a statement that it is a fabrication and totally false. there is no state of emergency. this will be interesting. they set a deadline. we are looking at these

encampments. we are live inside columbia. there is no classes. you have staff departures. commencement canceled. i look at these students, many of whom are showing up with face masks and sunglasses on. you cannot make out who they are. we will see if the white house will address this formally when karine jean-pierre steps up to that briefing podium in just a few moments. he will get back to you as we are watching this situation play out live. john, it is not just columbia. we have live pictures coming out of ut. the second week of protests we have been watching the air. per our latest email from our producer on the ground. ramping up. there are students locking arms as you can see in a circle around that tent encampment. police are on the lawn now flying a drone above them forming a circle. with their arms. that is about as much -- they are chanting "who's long?

our lawn" as much as other things. >> john: the university of texas will probably see a similar response that we saw last week. the texas university of texas police will come out and disperse the crowd. don't forget that columbia -- which i believe is still trying to make commencement happen. they have just told the students, if you don't leave, you are going to get suspended. they didn't say if you don't leave, we are going to clear the place out. all we are seeing, there is a reaction to the fact that columbia has said these students will likely lose their year if they don't clear out. probably nothing else will happen. i think all that we will see is a lot of students who now no longer have official capacity as students. >> sandra: you are green lighting them more than you have if you set a deadline and don't follow through and don't enforce it. >> john: i think they are

going to follow through and suspend them. they never said they are going to clear out the camp. >> sandra: suspended them? that would take officials walking through this crowd and noting who every single person is. i don't see that happening. is that realistic? >> john: didn't columbia say that they know who they are? >> sandra: well, okay. >> john: i think they do. as that continues to unfold, protesters at the university of california in los angeles broke into fights over the weekend. the school had to try to separate the sides with metal barricades. our next guest is a jewish doctor and professor who said he was denied into parts of the campus. joining us now, you will notice that dr. hoffman only has one earbud in his ear. he lost the other one when he was accosted on his way over to talk to us. doctor, what happened?

>> i would not call it a costing, i would call them assaults. i was walking to the quad area where i was planning on giving this interview as well as other interviews on cnn and 11:30. basically as i walked through an area that was barricaded, three thugs told me i had to stop walking. i ignored them and kept walking. a lot of them basically came in body checked me. my earpiece just flew out like a whiplash. it is basically nothing less than assault. >> john: the same thing happened over the weekend. there were physical altercations between rival protest groups. we see the aftermath of that going on for the ucla strategic communications vice chancellor said this in the statement of sunday. "ucla has a long history of peaceful protests.

we are heartbroken to report that physical altercations broke out. as an institution of higher education, we stand firmly for the idea that even when we disagree, we must still engage respectfully and recognize one another's humanity. birds are one thing. where is the enforcement? >> 9/11 is heartbreaking. october 7th is heartbreaking. pearl harbor is heartbreaking. this is not heartbreaking. i spoke to the chief of police on friday. and warned him that they need to enforce separation between these two training camps. their camp has no permit. it is completely illegal. we got a permit to have the quad facing it. this is not an altercation that happened between 2 group says they are claiming. they are came into our site, and they basically tried to push us out of our legal demonstration

that was permanent. that is where the scuffles broke out. they were trying to kick us out of our own demonstration. they are trying to muscle me out of coming to the quad right now. there is no law and order here. >> john: as we see at columbia university, the school has given students an ultimatum. they are out of that encampment which violates university rules, or you will be suspended. sandra brings up the point, how they know exactly who is in that encampment? ucla is hands-off with all of the spirit ucla at least need to suggest that it's going to get tough with this. >> i can tell you it's happening right now, because the chief of police told me. he takes his orders directly from vice chancellor. the security that is here are not bullies. they work for the police. the police are instructed not to come up here.

there is no law and order. the security people can stop these thugs from accosting me as i'm walking into a public area. what good are they if they can do that? >> john: something disturbing came to light. this was one of the leaders of the protest at columbia who is banned from the campus after this came out. this is what james sat on social media. listen to this. >> zionists don't deserve to live. the same way we are very comfortable accepting that ??? don't deserve to live, zionists, patient live in this world. yes, i feel very comfortable, very comfortable calling for those people to die. >> john: his definition of zionists was pretty broad to include the founders of israel

and prime minister benjamin netanyahu. what do you say to language like that? >> you know, when i say is, i still believe in free speech. i think this is hate speech. i think you could infer that there might be threats directly to a group of people. i feel sorry for that person. he is completely brainwashed. he's like a zombie in a cold. my problem is less with him and more with the people that allow him to be a student there. i have a problem with law enforcement that is nonexistent. we can start going after each and every thug and say, look, they are a thug. we share a country of loss. if we can't enforce our laws, been the thugs win. if that's where law and order has to be. i don't have any problem with any of the protest that protest at ucla.

we have to have law and order. >> john: we appreciate you joining us. we hope you get back to your office or residence or wherever you're going safely. thank you, sir. >> sandra: back to the live images out of columbia university at this h hour. that deadline has happened. the students have not left. they have the university told the students if they didn't leave, they would be suspended. i don't know. to go back to the point, who is going around noting who is they are not leaving? elise stefanik put out a tweet following that 2:00 p.m. deadline and nothing change in with the exception of more students protesting through 2:00 as, and gone. columbia's empty threats and weak leadership have failed and surrendered columbia's campus to the pro hamas, anti-semitic mob. the world is watching as you continue to failure jewish students. congress will hold these

institutions responsible. john, let's listen as we watch these protests grow. [indistinct] >> sandra: it appears that they are starting to mobilize in some way prayer we are waiting on a response from the white house. the press briefing was pushed out until 2:30. >> john: i would expect that all of these folks are coming out in solidarity with the students. look at the number of people who are out there around that encampment. this is a big finger to the president of columbia university and to that leadership to say, you can't tell us what to do. unlike usc that decided it was going to cancel its main commencement which 65,000 people are typically in attendance. they have a big stage outdoors and people walk up and get their diplomas.

i wafted at a couple of years ago. here at columbia university, for all intents and purposes, saying that f word and you to say that you can't tell us what to do, we are going to calm out here and show you. speak to the university a short time ago felt compelled to put out the short email saying that it is a fabrication of the truth to call this an emergency on our campus. they said there was rumor spreading that it was. you have to ask, what is next? these students and protesters are defying the university's to leave by 2:00, to vacate that campus and the encampment area. at 2:00 deadline has inspired. will they call the nypd into remove the students? >> john: i don't know where they have said in the past that they don't want the police they appear to the point that they are trying to make them may 15th

commencement happened. they can't make it happen with all the tents their people. were occupying the quad. it doesn't look like they are going to go in with any kind of force at the moment and take people out. if that doesn't happen, but i protesters win. i think they have a sense of how powerless their leadership at columbia really is. they might suspend these students, and it might cost them their graduation if they are fourth-year students. maybe a doctorate if they were a phd candidate. they don't seem to care. >> this is definitely growing in number. a suspension according to the school in that statement. i guess it goes to reason why they are all wearing face masks and sunglasses. i guess in an attempt to make sure that they don't know who they are. >> john: unless covid has suddenly become a thing again on campus, i don't think so.

>> remarkable, we are watching it. we go to be a university leadership have made their bed and forced to lie in it and let university of texas at yale and other places if they did bring the police into clear folks out. we are watching. and just about 15 minutes i had come out 30 it should start maybe. it has already been pushed back 45 minutes. we will see how the white house reacts to these protests plus this. >> what is your order at mcdonald's? >> let see. i would probably do quarter pounder with cheese and fries. i like the barbecue sauce. >> that is my favorite dipping sauce. >> that really happen. a hard-hitting new interview explaining what she likes to eat at mcdonald's. this before kicking off her economic opportunity tour. how do americans feel about that biden administration's economic policies?

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>> sandra: vice president, harris is kicking off a tour in atlanta. she is set to speak in a couple of moments. she sat down with talk show host drew barrymore for a hard-hitting interview on big macs and dating. cost of the big money show. fox news podcast host and daily mail columnist office him to see you both. that's get right to it. here's the interview with drew barrymore. >> i like the barbecue sauce. that is my favorite dipping sauce. >> we need you to be a mom that country. >> i'm not that person.

>> i love your laugh. >> my best friend who has a sister to me called me up. she is, like, i need you to go out with this guy. >> sandra: as if there is nothing else going on in the world. there is the awkward thing drew barrymore does. she gets really close. awkward. what is your thought when you look at that? >> the first thing i thought as i hope she knows a good orthopedic surgeon. she clearly tore her rotator cuff chucking those softballs. that is embarrassing, because these are incredibly serious times not only in foreign policy and basic safety for jewish students on college campuses across the country where they have been assaulted and othered and kept out of campus, faculty alike. not to mention the economic situation where the president is very much underwater. his writings are bad. the vice president's are worse.

they are going to have to have a bigger crash cart and then the drew barrymore so if they want to move the needle. >> the federal reserve. a job as day. all of this week and what we have talked about real wages after inflation are a lot lower than they wear and sometimes negative since the president took over. contrast that with president trump when inflation was low and growth was high. people where making money and felt financially better off. i think that there are a huge host of economic issues. not to mention the expiring tax cuts raising taxes on all americans including those that make less than $4,000. >> sandra: you can take the live images out of columbia university and ask yourself, what is the future? an opinion piece asking the question of student loan debt an emergency. if loans seem to have no downside, contain tuition.

in this case, there is a student loan bailout by this administration. are we bailing out students that are out there, spewing anti-semitic rhetoric to their jewish students and colleagues? >> there are things that have kept colleges afloat. the federal government tinkering with loans and funding and education and massive donors that have given generously to these once prestigious institutions which are crumbling philosophically before our eyes. as they are withholding their gifts, these colleges are really going to have to rethink the way they establish themselves in people's lives. that establishment will fall apart if they don't have the generous support of these donors who were absolutely sick of these dangerous and i somatic environments. it is not just jewish donors. it's a lot of people waking up to the system. these colleges have to wake up to the fact that they have no

incentive to keep costs low. >> i like what you said about defunding on the donors. you put your money where your mouth is. when you see the money go, that is when the behavior will ch change. in "the wall street journal," the eye of the beholder. this, be a degree is a luxury item. that can change depending how the money goes. >> sandra: that can change real fast or less taken what we are hearing on the growing protest in new york city. >> you can't hide. you are supporting genocide. >> sandra: "you can't hide." i will quote you are supporting genocide." they are mobilizing, marching, defying the 2:00 deadline to leave that campus and end the encampment. i don't know. i don't see any police showing up. i don't see any university

officials getting a hold of t this. if you don't honor about 2:00 deadline, i mean, not only are you allowing this, you are empowering these protesters. >> they populate new york city, new york, city. leo swarmed every event like this. this is essentially what they live for. a lot of them aren't columbia students, and they don't have jobs. they thrive on this attention. >> sandra: if columbia's officials don't have the backbone to stop lawless anti-semites from taking over their campus, they should resign until columbia fixes this problem by rooting out the hate on its campus that you heard in the chanting, every last donors should withhold funds. congress should strip all federal funding. it looks like that's where things are going next. >> followed about money. as long as these people have these endowments, nothing is going to change. it's up to the federal government to decide the funding

based on whether there is anti-semitism or not. >> send your kids to good schools in the south and midwest. >> sandra: it is happening there too. at the ut campus, more protesters are emerging there at this hour. we will keep watching it. >> john: we welcome where that deadline has calming down. at the moment, it would appear as though the protesters have won, because the administration at columbia university did not get what it wanted in terms of students leaving. because all of those tents are still there. it would appear that the protesters have told columbia university that they can take their notice to encampment that they sent out earlier today. roll it up type. >> sandra: at some point, classes are closed. this is trespassing. the school can call local enforcement. >> john: they will not do th that. >> sandra: it's going to continue and grow in number as

we are seeing happening right now. >> john: of the school will likely do nothing about it. speak to that briefing was pushed back to 2:30. we are likely moments away from upper russian forces are advancing through ukraine's eastern front. his vladimir putin taking advantage as the war-torn country awaits more aid? te. this customer had auto glass damage, but he was busy working from home... ...so he scheduled with safelite in just a few clicks. we came to his house... then we got to work. we replaced his windshield... ...and installed new wipers to protect his new glass. >> customer: looks great. thank you. >> tech: my pleasure. >> vo: we come to you for free. schedule now for free mobile service at safelite.com. ♪ safelite repair, safelite replace. ♪ isolated...depressed... and embarrassed. that's how it felt to live with bladder and bowel incontinence. but that changed when my urologist told me about axonics therapy. a long-lasting solution that has really changed my life.

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>> 2:33. the protesters are still set up. in new york city at columbia university, this is that gaza solidarity encampment. the university said to the students get out of your get suspended. they are still here. they don't look like they are going anywhere. the university did give them this morning here. the nypd is on high alert. we saw more officers lining up outside of the main gates. they still did not get a call from calamities president who told the students that she was no longer going to negotiate with them. negotiations had stopped and they needed to leave. you can see that tents and the palestinian flags. they were calling on the nypd to back down a short time ago and telling the school that they wanted these kids did not get in trouble who were out here even though they weren't supposed to be. i will have my photographer a walk with me to show you.

it does look like some of the times used to be busier. there's not as many. you can see more grass. some might have moved. the university said we knows who's in this crowd and you're going to get suspended in a graduation is. they would be able to graduate. over here as well, you can see some of the protesters marching around the campus. this is kind of in the activity and most people left leg gaza solidarity encampment walking around in the quad at the university. as the time counts, people want to know especially jewish students and their parents. they want to know who is in charge at columbia university. is that the president who has been growing call to step down or the students who won't go anywhere even though they've been told they are supposed to be out of the area. >> sandra: we are showing inside and outside the campus there. we are also being told that outside the campus, but the crowd is getting much larger. they are chanting the usual

chants, anti-israel chants. columbia is announcing that they are going to have a virtual update. a briefing is going to happen at 6:00 p.m. the rest of the details remain to be determined. that's a long time from now. you are talking 3.5 hours from now. and a good four hours past the deadline when they said the students have to be gone, or they would be suspended, alexis. >> why would they leave? they are not being really escorted off campus by the university. more people are joining in, because i think that they feel that they have the power on this campus. when you are told that you've got to get outta here and no one comes to move you, you're going to stay. the nypd gets put in this position where they have to wait, because it's a private property on this campus. they get the call and move any comment to the zip ties and try to take the students out as

quickly as they can. we will see what happens in the next 30 minutes or so. >> sandra: we will get back to you soon as we await the white house briefing. we will see what the white house response is to these growing protests thank you. >> john: last spring and rip tire building retired general. we should note, general if we can bring up pictures, university of texas at austin, dispersal order has been issued according to ut austin police. these protesters are being told to leave the south mall area immediately. thank you for your cooperation. we see police amassing there again as they did last week. you have been in command here in the past. what do you think of the commanders at columbia university? >> when you come to riot control, it is like a riot control. you have to have overwhelming force to handle it. they need to bring in the state

police or whatever it will take. let me do a quick move on that. how this can actually get solved in a hurry. pick up the phone and call and go in and finish the job. do it complete and make this the end of the beginning and go back and start figuring out how you will handle gaza. as long as this conflict goes on, you're going to see these kind of demonstrations. the other thing i would do if somebody needs to probably have these young men and women look at history. when they talk about, how about looking back at world war ii to see what happened. go to auschwitz and spend a day at auschwitz and you can see what happened there. >> john: a lot of the student protesters have been interviewed by various news organizations. you know what that means? do you know which river in which see? a lot of them had no clue. in terms of what these folks who are marching around the quad are

fighting for, in gaza, the united states is assembling a floating pier a few miles out sure to have the frame. they are going to move into gaza to bring in boatloads of humanitarian assistance. idf forces are on the ground in that area laying the groundwork for about a floating pier be able to come in. this into wet pet writer said at the pentagon briefing regarding stuff that's going on. we apparently don't have that. let me read it to you. "we are aware of reports that a small number of mortars landed in the vicinity of the marshall area for humanitarian assistance. that will eventually be the delivery side that this will support. it is important to highlight that this occurred before any u.s. forces have started moving anything. there will be no u.s. forces on the ground. these folks are supporting the people who are throwing mortars at the israeli forces who are laying the groundwork for about floating pier to come into bring

humanitarian assistance to gaza. do they even know what is happening? >> no, they don't. of course hamas is going to do that. they don't want to have the aide come in. they made that comment about netanyahu. the only way this is going to quiet down. this will continue as long as this goes on. >> john: police moving in at the university of texas at austin. this could be the difference between a public university in a private university. you've got texas state troopers there. you have got the university of austin police. clearly, the leadership at ut austin is saying that what we are not going to let this disrupt campus activities. compare their leadership they are leadership at columbia. >> it shows positive aggressive

leadership. you have to demonstrate strength through the students that this will not happen at the university. historically, we have gone back and have people's heads explodes when you talk about the insurrection. eisenhower used the insurrection act to bring nine students in little rock central high school in the mid-'50s. you say you are violating the law. you are talking about. two other students that are there. the anti-semitism is just horrible. ut is handing late correctly. columbia is not. >> john: let's cut to that. >> when we ask for amnesty, they gave us more discipline. earlier this morning, the university delegates appeared at the entrance of our encampment with disciplinary notices. essentially, alerting students that they could choose to do one of two things. 1, signed a form that would put

students on academic probation on the condition that they abide by all university rules until june 30th, 2025, or until their graduation -- whichever comes first. or, the students would be suspended, losing access to their housing. losing access to campus, losing access to health care on campus, and losing their right to graduation if they are graduating student. essentially, these are attempts to stifle the student movement. [applause] >> one second in, then notices are another intimidation factor family university. these tactics -- against our people in palestine.

ironically, students that their rights to demonstrate would be protected by the university if they sign these papers. we refuse to operate on the basis of speculation. we want assurances. this encampment is a minor inconvenience compared to the generational shaping events taking place now and gaza. throughout the negotiations, the administration treated this movement as a matter of student discipline rather than a movement, rather than as one of the great moral questions of this generation. columbia is shortsighted and political decision making today in the face of a genocide that has gone into the lives of 34,000 human beings, women, men, babies and gaza, that has destroyed lineages and heritage sites and universities. it will be a stain on his legacy

for every the students on this encampment are a gift to columbia. we offered to give the university back as a principal with all eyes on columbia, the administration could have chosen to do best in a manner that aligns with its -- columbia would rather -- mutation instead of being crowned with students and faculty for raising these important questions, we have been hit with little more than petty attacks. this is not a matter of simply violating university rules. this is a movement and antiwar movement. we have spark similar encampments across the nation. and even across the globe. [applause] >> what is your name? do your name please. >> mah m.o. ud --

>> we would like to reiterate that our presence was never -- members of the columbia community and unprecedented ways on this campus. people from various walks of life coalesce to deliver food and supplies to do their homework on the lawn, to make their professors to communities to read a book at the people's library. we will not be -- by this tactic. >> john: we are going to jump from columbia university now to the white house where karine jean-pierre is talking about all this. >> secretary jean-pierre: he stands squarely against any violent rhetoric or hate threats and physical intimidation and hate speech obviously. we believe and we have said anti-semitism is dangerous. it is hate speech and it is

abhorrent. there is no place for anti-semitism on campuses or anywhere else. it is a painful moment. we get that. we got that it is a painful moment that americans are dealing with. free expression has to be done with in the law. we are going to continue to be very clear about that. that has not changed. we have been very consistent. >> has the white house ever had a reaction to the decision to restart operations in gaza? >> secretary jean-pierre: and i first say that the work that humanitarian aid workers do is brave, it is incredibly important. it is good to hear that they are going back to deal, to do the brave work that they continue to do. not just in gaza but haiti and sudan and many other places around the globe. and so, we are happy to hear that. as you know, the president had a

conversation with the prime minister about making sure that we deconflict and protect the lives of humanitarian aid workers are they are out there being brave, offering assistance to palestinians in gaza. and so, we have seen some steps being taken by israel to do just that. we will ways encourage and continue to have those discussions with israel to do more. we are certainly encouraged by that by humanitarian aid workers from wc k going back out there and also encouraged by the steps that the israeli government has taken to make sure that you more humanitarian aid get sent. >> about that decision, are you confident that aid workers are not going to be at further risk? >> we are going to continue to be very clear. >> sandra: live to the ut campus. we will continue monitoring their briefing.

this is an arrest that was just made. we've seen a growing police presence within the last 45 minutes. austin, texas, campus. police in riot gear are on the scene. students are locking arms. they are chanting directly at the police who showed up in that riot gear. i would say the presence of protesters has just doubled in the past 30 minutes or so. let's take in some of the sounds from austin. [indistinct] >> sandra: what they are chanting out of the students protesters are chanting "there is no riot here. why are you in riot gear?" one of the arrests that has been made there happen just a few moments ago. >> john: this is exactly what

we saw last week minus the police on horseback. they have not arrived yet. i assume that they will momentarily. the university of texas. again, it is often, but it is texas. they are not about to let these protesters take over the area and disrupt what is going on. they bring in the police. contrast that with columbia university which is a private university. the nypd can't whenever they feel like it walk onto campus unless there is violence or threat of violence or someone's life is in danger. we see the difference seen here. >> sandra: 30 minutes ago, our producer on the ground told us there's 50-60 officers including state troopers. they have been putting up barricades. the number of police has been growing that they have on ca campus. the crowd is a lot larger now. do your point about seeing this similarly last week, our producer is noting that this is a lot bigger and what we saw there thursday and friday of

last week. and the arrest that was just made, we are hoping to get some more information on that shortly. it looks like there is a new notice going out about that protest happening in austin. >> john: notice of this personal order. it says "i represent the university of texas at austin police department. your conduct is in violation of penal code sections 42.01, disorderly conduct. i command you in the name of the texas police department to disperse, if not, you shall be arrested for violation of the aforementioned penal code, disorderly conduct. it looks like the arrests are being made for disorderly conduct. it is a misdemeanor. obviously, they are probably not going to press charges, i wouldn't think. at least they are trying to break things up and calm things down. what is going on on the sidewalk here at columbia university.

this would be 113th to 116th street on manhattan's upper west side. we see that quad is fairly quiet. folks out in the street are a lot more boisterous and they are in the inside. they are mirroring what is going on at the university texas. >> sandra: it will be really interesting to see how often is dealing with this versus new york city. a big police presence there at the university of texas. an arrest just made moments ago. columbia university. do we have "the new york post" on the ground there? can we pop her up? we know that you sent out a note earlier. it was ahead of the deadline, i should say. the deadline that the university set for people to leave there. you said you spoke to a student organizer at columbia who announced, we will not give them what they want. and committed to making it "hard

to disperse us." what are you sitting on the ground? >> yeah, the 2:00 p.m. deadline, there is no sign as far as i can see of any of the campus security. there were as you mentioned, more nypd bands outside campus. i have not seen anybody come in. there's no cops. the chant larry nassar continuing circling the quad where the enchantment is. >> sandra: we are looking live at ut's campus where things have gotten confrontational. >> john: last spring and in retired nypd inspector paul morrow. when you take a look at the split screen, what is happening or not happening at columbia university versus what is happening at the university of texas, is not merely a demonstration between what the rules are in a private university versus a public one? >> i think it is. a public school obviously, the

public has a lot more right of egress and ingress. it is also a difference in the attitude. columbia has been mishandling from the get-go. >> sandra: hey, paul, a live scene. ut police are having to drag kids off the campus. it looks like arrests are happening one after the other now. a moment ago, we saw police dragging a man by his legs across the ground. a lot more arrests being made. paul, continue on what this would be like for a law enforcement to get this under control. >> well, i can tell you what will happen at columbia. at some point, they are going to call the nypd in peru the students are emboldened. they are going to fight. ultimately, alvin bragg drops all of the charges. everybody sues the city of new york. the city of new york settles for millions. the metrics come out about how much money nypd cost the city in

lawsuits. that is considered wisdom for police brutality. this is a continuing cycle that funds the activist class that we have in a lot of the blue cities. certainly here in new york, it is a cl career path and a lucrae one. >> john: this is often, but it is still in texas. let us why we see the reaction from the texas police and the state troopers. if police were suddenly given the okay to sweep in and columbia, reflecting on what you just said a moment ago, what do you think the upshot of that would be? >> it wouldn't be pretty. i think a lot of these students don't understand that the police don't make the laws. they are empowered to enforce them. the paradigm of police work when you have a legal that harasses the following. ask, tile, make. that is essentially about one, two, three on it.

if you are empowered to make an arrest and you are not getting compliance, you are allowed to use force. level of force obviously in new york is always a controversial thing. it's hard to thread the needle. you wouldn't believe how many rules they arrive. that is how it goes. all of these students have never seen a bar fight. when the police coming to take hold of them and put them in handcuffs, you know, these are for the most part, pretty well off kids who have had a pretty soft life. all of a sudden, they are getting put in handcuffs here that is why you see them screaming as if their lives are ending. all that is as a pair of handcuffs. as we saw when this started at columbia, they were given a summons and immediately released. you would have thought it was the end of the world. i don't know how this is going to shake out at columbia. they've let it get out of hand. these things like deadlines and everything else are only serving to put a spotlight on them. this is very performative. they want to be seen.

i actually think that if columbia as a private school that has already gone to remote learning just left it like that, it's going to be hot in those tents. eventually when no one is watching, they are going to get bored and go home especially when their phones run out of power. >> sandra: you start to think about these things. when do they cut off the electricity? i think people get confused when they watch this. they say, okay. it would be really simple if columbia wanted to say, there is no classes. classes have been canceled. they have gone completely re remote. >> john: look what's going on here in new york. what's going on on the sidewalk? it looks like someone is being arrested. this is on the public sidewalk. we see a woman being taken away right in front of the 115th street station on the subway

there. obviously, nypd can affect an arrest here. that woman is on public pro property. >> exactly. there are a number of charges that could apply. simple disorderly conduct to unlawful assembly, creating a public nuisance or maybe something more serious. we didn't see what happened. chances are again she will be given a summons and let right out. it will be a viral all over social media. you know, it will be considered police brutality. >> sandra: i could be wrong. the woman they just arrested it look to me like she was a student. certainly not undergrad. you start to see that. there's a lot of folks that are on the columbia campus that to look like students. you got people of general public that are adding to this. there is a police presence. this is where the campus meets the public. if columbia wanted to say, no one allowed on campus. this is trespassing, call the police come in they could. they are just not.

>> they could. they are not. from the beginning, they really needed to decide whether or not we are going to clear this out and continue classes are going to allow this third world encampment to take over our l lawn. go to remote learning and wait them out. the commencement is a couple of weeks out. really, it is a failure of nerve. if they just left them there, they have already gone to the remote learning. the jewish students are not being harassed now. they are not even on campus. if they are harassed, you got to make arrests. if you waited them out and made a deadline, and said, by commencement time, you will have been there a month. we have given you enough leeway. if you are still there and attempt to disrupt the commencement, you are expelled. it seems where they are going at harvard. >> sandra: and looks like there was some

>> it looks like there was a briefing there when asked about the ongoing protest in a statement from the white house cream sean pierce said there have been no conversations between the white house and university leadership q factor thank you, you know, here's a moment who are you step up at the white house and say back bring some calm to the situation and tell people to go home. >> well, you know, i don't think anyone would listen to him at least not at columbia university. then you run into the problem that the president says something and nobody listens to him. paul, i'm interested -- >> i thank the white house is addressing this right now. can we go to the white house quick. >> potential hateful violence or has no place in america anti-semitism we're going to call out it is important and that is hate speech. we will be consistent when it

comes to those types of decisions on campuses that is something for college universities leadership to decide on. >> finally one more as a dog lover hears of -- >> alright john we're getting a heads up she was addressing it right then but they just maintain that they don't support violence. >> so real quick paul we've got 30 seconds left, what is the threshold that could trigger nypd actually going on the campus? >> when you start to sea real injuries and it starts to spill over into public spaces than of course -- and of course is someone just calls 911. if someone their calls 911 and says they've been injured or attacked than the police have to respond. but right now on private property, colombia is the complainant and that's what you need. >> alright thank you paul. we've got to jump out we was you tomorrow i'm john roberts. >> and sandra smith sink you for joining us. martha starts now. >> martha: are you guy